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.hack//20th Anniversary Book -Interview- Translation
(P.128-131)
Special Interview Project #2
Listen to President Matsuyama
Looking back on the 20-year history of .hack
with the G.U. Development Team
The three members of the .hack (series) development team, who have been involved in the project since .hack//G.U. and now lead the .hack series, spoke about their perspectives and difficulties in their respective roles.
—-xxxx—-
Kazuyoshi Futatsuka
He was in charge of producing in-game movies for .hack//G.U., as well as supervising cinematography and directing videos for .hack//G.U. TRILOGY and .hack//Sekai no Mukou Ni. He was also the art director for .hack//G.U. Last Recode and produced a live drama for the “.hack//LiVE” (2010) live event. Recently, he worked as the director of Demon Slayer -Kimetsu no Yaiba-: Hinokami Chronicles.
Hisashi Natsumura
He has been involved in the development of the series since .hack//G.U. for creating motion, effects, and 3D models. In .hack//G.U. TRILOGY, he was in charge of rigging 3D models (preparation work for animation production), and in .hack//G.U. Last Recode, he worked as the director. He is currently working as a senior game designer and is also involved in the development of Demon Slayer -Kimetsu no Yaiba-: Hinokami Chronicles.
Masayuki Sano
He was in charge of the limited-time scenario for .hack//fragment, sub-scenarios for .hack//G.U., .hack//Link, .hack//Versus, and .hack//G.U. Last Recode Vol.4 Reconnection. He also worked on scenarios for .hack//LiVE (2010), Thanatos Report, and .hack//G.U. Begins and has written a few novels in the .hack series (like .hack//Bullet). Recently, he participated as a game designer in Demon Slayer -Kimetsu no Yaiba-: Hinokami Chronicles.
Looking Back on 20 Years of .hack
Matsuyama: Looking back on 20 years of .hack, it’s a bit of a long time ago, but what is the most memorable project that you have been involved with?
Futatsuka: I would have to say my first anime film work, .hack//G.U. TRILOGY. The size of members of Team Sai (a video production team formed when an anime film project was decided) was small at the time. What started as just a collection of movies turned into a full-fledged production, including scenarios, which was a lot of fun.
Matsuyama: I can say it’s fun now, but it was tough back then (laughs). As Futatsuka-san mentioned, we started just lightly editing and summarizing the movies from all three volumes of the .hack//G.U. game. However, as terrestrial broadcasting was transitioning to digital, the resolution had to be up-converted from 720p to 1080p, and the requirements increased to the point that the script and CG had to be done from scratch if the film wanted to be presented as a visual work.
Futatsuka: That’s right. It was a transitional period from SD to HD, and as the size of the data grew, it became very difficult to process the images. I remember discussing with the president about the cost of the rendering server and saying something like, “How much money do we need to spend?” There were a lot of firsts, so there was a lot of hard work, but it was quite fun (laughs).
Matsuyama: Games can only be played within the limits of the specifications of the game console, but with video works, once they are rendered, they are all video, so there were no restrictions on parts, which was a big difference. Rendering cannot be done for free, and it takes a lot of time, so there is still a lot of redoing and reworking, but I think there was a difference in that it opened up a new level of visual flair.
Futatsuka: Also, the knowledge I gained from game production came into play. The way effects were created, and the way particles were suppressed, it expressed well, it was very interesting for me coming from the video industry.
Matsuyama: But there was a time when we created, even the parts of the background art that were not shown, as is the habit of game in-house. If you were creating a video work, you should only create the part that would be seen on the screen. (laugh).
Natsumura: I was also in charge of creating the bones and rigs for the models in .hack//G.U. TRILOGY, but at first, the models were created without worrying about polygons being filled in, just like in a game. But if the skirts were to get stuck in the thighs in visual work, that would be bad. We were sometimes asked to fix it with a bone, and we would say, “No, we can’t do that, so let’s start from the model and fix it.”
Matsuyama: In a sense, that experience was utilized in high-end game production. However, back then, we had to work very recklessly. I couldn’t do it anymore, but I would stay overnight at the office.
Futatsuka: It was a time of change, and we were still young (laughs). In 2008, when .hack//G.U. TRILOGY was released, the company logo changed the stance on doing something interesting, and the president’s ambition is also on display.
Matsuyama: I’ve heard a lot about you, but which project left the biggest impression on you, Natsumura?
Natsumura: After all, it was .hack//G.U. that I was first involved with. During my first day at the company, I saw the prototype of the data-drain scene where Kite was draining Haseo’s data, even though Haseo’s design was different from ours. At the time, I was a rookie with no idea of what was right and what was left, but I was allowed to do many things I wanted to do in the project. I could do the motion for Atoli, the main heroine if I wanted to. I remember being surprised that they would entrust me with such an important part of the project. After that, I said I wanted to do anything and everything (laughs).
Matsuyama: In addition to motion, you also did modeling and effects work. That may have been the last time we could do that.
Natsumura: I appreciate the good times we had. However, Anai-san, my supervisor at that time, would criticize me for not being able to manage the schedule. He would say things like, “Don’t bring other companies’ work to me on your own,” or “But I wanted to do it” (laughs).
Matsuyama: I’m very pleased with your energy (laughs). The scale of development for PS2 was completely different from today. Even for .hack//G.U. there were about 30 developers, so each person was responsible for different tasks.
Natsumura: That’s right. Everyone around us was working regardless of the industry. We would first create a model together, and then add motion after that was completed. We worked full overtime every day, but it was still a lot of fun. I think I was at my most workaholic back then. I think those were the days when workaholism was hippie-dippie.
Matsuyama: Well, it’s time (laughs).
100 threat “Joke scenarios” in a row!
Matsuyama: What project left a deep impression on you, Yano-san?
Yano: I was given my first main scenario of .hack//Link. The number of scenarios, both main and sub, was overwhelming. It was a lot of work in terms of time, but I was able to learn how to create stories in real time while writing them, and I was able to get feedback from internal checks, so I learned a lot.
Matsuyama: Partly not because it was a title for PSP, but also because the amount of text in .hack//Link was so big that the cost of localization became too high and there was no American or European version.
Yano: Even if all three volumes of .hack//G.U. were added, the volume of .hack//Link would still be greater than the previous one.
Matsuyama: It’s a funny story to be able to travel through the stories of all the .hack games and have all the characters appear in the game (laughs). It was also unusual for a PSP title to take three and a half years to develop. The initial cost estimate was to complete the game in one year, but I decided on my own that we had to go as far as we could go, which made the second and third years very difficult. Do you have a personal favorite scene in the .hack//Link scenario?
Yano: .hack//G.U. is the most exciting part of .hack//Link, so I would like to focus on that in the main scenario. The sub-scenario is the one where the player makes 100 jokes (laughs).
Matsuyama: That was terrible (laughs). We didn’t omit anything, but we had to put it in 100 times, and we had to record the whole thing, so the cost of localizing it would have been huge. Do you have any memorable Jokes?
Yano: Toward the end, I had the character say something that was not a joke at all, just to show that he was running out of energy. I remember writing things like, “I want to drink tea,” or “I want to drink tea on a telephone pole” (Laughs).
Matsuyama: It’s really silly, isn’t it? (Laughs)
What we were conscious of in .hack//G.U.
Matsuyama: .hack can be created freely as long as you keep the main points in mind, so I don’t think there was much of an inheritance of the worldview from “MUJI” (Original .hack//Games) when creating .hack//G.U., but was there anything that you were conscious of?
Yano: Since the game is still .hack, we were very conscious of depicting the duality of the Internet and the real world, and of not denigrating the Internet. While we do depict the bad aspects of the Internet, we are also conscious of the positive aspects of connecting people in a work that is an anthem for the Internet.
Matsuyama: That is the core of the series. .hack is a game that allows players to go back and forth between the real world and the game world, creating an experience where the story can be seen as three-dimensional by creating both worlds. What about Futatsuka-san and Natsumura-san? What were you conscious of when creating new work in the series?
Futatsuka: I had the duality of the real world and the Internet in mind. When we were creating the characters, whether it was Haseo or Atoli, we wanted them to act in a way that would make the audience fall in love with the character. The creators were also very conscious of the motions and the love they had for the characters, how this character would act, and how this character would not act.
Natsumura: We were trying to do a lot of new things with .hack//G.U. and since the game was set in The World R:2, we were not thinking about the succession of the world view as President Matsuyama said. As a newly-hatched employee, I was more concerned about the quality in front of me. However, there were some changes in .hack//G.U. Last Recode.
Matsuyama: You are already the director of .hack//G.U. Last Recode.
Natsumura: That’s right. So, as we worked with President Matsuyama and Niizato-san on the scenario that Yano-san proposed, we were careful to incorporate the same year 2018 as in the play and not let the essence of other eras get in the way, like the timeline of the series.
Matsuyama: Is there any part of .hack//G.U Last Recode that left a particularly strong impression on you?
Natsumura: In .hack, you’ve already talked about the duality of the Internet and the real world, but in Vol. 4 of .hack // G.U. Last Recode (Reconnection), there wasn’t much that could be done in the real world. That’s why in the final event with Ovan, I wanted him to act not as Ovan but as Masato Indou, so I made some very impressive lines. The last choice was just a bad joke to make it a festival since it was the last one (laugh).
Matsuyama: .hack is CyberConnect2’s original RPG Series, and since we created the entire world, story, and game experience, we often had to bounce ideas off each other during development to make it more interesting.
Natsumura: That’s right. I think that part was really strong.
Matsuyama: When .hack//G.U. was released, it wasn’t released at the same time worldwide, but the Japanese version was released first, so we had more leeway in terms of text deadlines than we do now. We would add text until the very last minute, saying, “This will make it even better”.
Natsumura: When we entered the debugging phase, we would say, “Let’s improve where we can, and fix things.” The programmers would get angry at me (laughs).
Matsuyama: I’m just wondering when you are updating the site (laughs).
Natsumura: But when I explain it to them, they understand. It is a terrible thing to have a master come every four months, now that I think about it.
The “parody mode” divided users’ opinions. (Click the link for the Video)
The Parody Mode which is full of lines that overturn the main story setting, was it controversial? Objection?
Matsuyama: One of the elements that did not make it into .hack//G.U. was the parody mode, but that too had its twists and turns. Originally, since the story was not completed because all four volumes of Mujirushi were sold separately as a product, we decided that we wanted a new element in the second installment, considering the volume. After consulting with Kazunori Ito, the scriptwriter, we came up with Parody Mode.
Futatsuka: Amazingly, you dubbed the entire show, even the parody mode.
Matsuyama: It was funny (laughs). But at the time, many people said, “If you don’t have time to put in more scenarios, increase the volume of the main story.” That’s why .hack//G.U., we decided to remove the parody mode and increase the amount of gameplay in the main story, only to be met with comments like, “You should have a parody mode.”
Natsumura: Yes, there was.
Matsuyama: So for .hack//G.U. TRILOGY, we included a special feature film with different dialogues from the main story, but again we were told, “If you have time for that”. That’s why we didn’t include it in .hack//Link again. Including these aspects, the dichotomy between the Internet and the real world and the anthem of the Internet was the axis of the series, but other aspects of the series were always new concepts, a new .hack to compete with.
Message to all the members who lost their lives due to the COVID-19
Matsuyama: Do you have any memories of Niizato-san and Anai-san?
Natsumura: I still remember being scolded for bouncing around from job to job because I enjoyed it so much. Other than that, I think it was working on .hack//G.U. Last Recode. Niizato-san has been working on the series for a long time, so he has a good sense of what should be done in terms of .hack and can make quick judgments. Whenever I was unsure of a decision, I would go to him and he would give me a quick answer, including an explanation, such as, “This is the way to do it.” In that sense, they were very helpful.
Yano: One of the most memorable words from Niizato-san was when he talked about .hack//G.U. with all the members. He said something like, “You may think that the deadlines are endless and it will never get easier, but rest assured that “.hack//G.U.” is just a special case.”
Matsuyama: That’s part of the CyberConnect2 culture. Whenever we were in a pinch, we would gather the development team together and have someone stand in front of them to explain the situation and inspire them. During the COVID-19 disaster, we used to have a video conference every Monday morning between the Fukuoka headquarters and the Tokyo studio, where we would gather all the staff and report on the progress of all the projects, but we haven’t done that for two years now. In the past, people would say, “Why didn’t you get your members together? In fact, how did .hack//G.U. compare to other projects?”
Yano: Other projects were much harder too (laughs).
Natsumura: It was tough on projects other than .hack//G.U., but I was able to get a lot of work done on .hack//G.U. The president said, “We’re just getting started.” I took that to heart and made some suggestions, only to be told, “Do you know what beta means?” (Laughs).
Matsuyama: Beta is all-in. I don’t know what I’m going to do if I build from there. Do you have any memories of your life, Futatsuka-san?
Futatsuka: I would say it is the president rather than Niizato-san and Anai-san. We have been working together for a long time on games and videos, and of course, we are very particular about our work on-site, but it is the president who is the most particular until the very last minute.
Matsuyama: Well, you know what I mean (laughs).
Futatsuka: But it’s also fun to hear the opinions clearly and to rework things, so in that sense, it’s been great to work together for 20 years on .hack, and we’ve learned a lot from each other. Conversely, from the president’s point of view, are there any memorable experiences?
Matsuyama: There are many, but one is .hack//G.U. TRILOGY. There was a delivery date that Bandai Visual had agreed upon, but I was talking to Futatsuka-san about how we couldn’t make it in time, and when I looked at him, he was asleep. He was holding up a paper lantern by his nose like in a manga (laughs), and his eyes had already turned into a “3”.
Futatsuka: We were at our limits in many ways (laughs).
Matsuyama: I thought it was too much to ask, so I sent all the members home and called the producer at. I was still young and it was that kind of time, but I was still able to say, “What can’t be done in time?” I couldn’t tell whether he was apologizing or angry (laughs). (Laughs) Because of this, we are said to have poor schedule management, but at the root of our attitude is the question of whether it is acceptable to compromise to meet delivery deadlines.
Natsumura: If you have read the manga The Chaser Game, which is set in our company, you might be thinking “Oh, ・・・・・・.” They may be thinking, “Ah.” That’s because it’s a true story. That’s because it’s a real-life manga (laughs).
The 20th anniversary of the series is thanks to our fans!
Matsuyama: Well, it’s time to wrap things up, but first of all, please give a message to your fans.
Futatsuka: I would like to thank all of our fans for helping us celebrate the 20th anniversary of .hack. First and foremost, I would like to thank you for your love and support of .hack. I can’t thank you enough.
Natsumura: Thank you very much for your support, whether you have been playing since the original game or have become a fan since the later games. Your reactions to our PVs and measures were the driving force for us to create even better products during the development process. In that sense, I believe that we have created this series together with all of you. Witnessing the overwhelming enthusiasm of the audience at the live event .hack//LiVE made me realize how happy I am to have been involved in this work.
Yano: I know this is the same as both of your comments, but I truly believe that it is thanks to everyone’s support that we have been able to celebrate our 20th anniversary. I don’t know what the future holds, but I always hope to be able to talk about .hack again someday.
Matsuyama: And lastly, since the subject is “What I want to say to President Matsuyama,” I would like to comment as if I were not here.
Futatsuka: That’s a tough one to make (laughs). But I enjoyed working with the president on .hack and it was a great learning experience, so I hope we can continue to work together in the future.
Natsumura: There are times during development when I feel like I’m not doing a good job because I’m on a deadline, but the president gives me a push when that happens. It is of course difficult to hear the president say that something is wrong, but I am grateful for that, and I hope that the president will continue to do so. I would also suggest that you moderate the amount of alcohol you drink (laughs).
Yano: I have been involved in a wide range of projects, including main and sub-scenarios for games, scripts for play readings, novels, and original works for manga. I am truly grateful to the president for allowing me to experience so many things. I would like to ask for your continued encouragement and support.
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